So does anyone have any thoughts on adventure riding gear?
i.e. off-road. long distance. multi-temperature.
For me the key thing is going to be venting because it's going to be hot as hell.
Thoughts?
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My KATHMANDU gear is great for up into the low 80's, after that it's got to be mesh or hybrid. I'm just going to get some MX gear for playing around in the summer, the KATHMANDU will be fine for everything else. Will grab a pair of more off-road boots as well and a off-road biased helmet. For fire roads and most trails the like regular adventure gear like mine is fine. Once it gets super hot I have the mesh equivalent jacket already and would just need MX pants.
bump.
So I went to an after-hours apparel event over at Bob's BMW last night. I thought it was just going to be new versions of some of the gear they already had but to my surprise it was more like a mini-convention.
It was a catered event done to the same quality level as their for-fee special events.
And it was crowded. There were quite a few people there. What really surprised me was the outside vendors he had.
I noticed a guy, I have forgotten his name but hope that he'll join us here, wearing a Klim Badlands 2 suit. I talked to him for quite some time. Interestingly, despite having purchased it just 6 weeks earlier he was not entirely pleased with his purchase. He pointed out a number of niggling things that were bothering him such a stitching that was coming undone in some seams on the jacket and pants to some velcro panels being slightly crooked. "Just not up to German quality I've gotten used to." he said. (I said nothing.
)
Then, to my surprise, he mentioned that Klim had a representative there. It turns out they had the Klim Badlands Pro in my size for me to try on.
It's certainly a solid suit. The fact that they seemed to only provide it in S/M/L sizing was a negative in my opinion. I would liked to have something fit a little closer in a "Long" but that option is not available, at least not off the shelf. Putting it on and wearing the thing for a while, I began to suspect that the features/benefits/fit of the suit do not justify the price. I just couldn't see myself living with the thing for that long. My thought had been that maybe it would end up being something that might replace the Transit Suit as my preferred touring suit, but it's simply not in the same league IMHO.
So I've decided against the Klim.
I also took a close look at Rev-It's new offerings. After how disappointing I've found the Ignition 2 jacket/suit to be I just can't see myself buying another Rev-It suit. IMHO their gear is simply not durable enough.
I also took a very close look at the Olympia Moab and Nomad jackets. Very good venting and they seem to have upped their game a bit but neither jacket seemed like it would handle the punishment of a trip like this very well. I also looked at the X-Moto and it seemed a little too "over-featured" and I think all the silly liner zippers will just end up failing. The camel back was also badly positioned IMHO and might induce a spine injury in an off.
They had a number of BMW Rally 3 suits on sale. I hadn't considered the Rally suit but I have to admit it's very well done. The fit is excellent and the craftsmanship is definite a step up from Klim, again IMHO. There seems to be plenty of venting but not as much as I would really like. Even on sale, the price is in the Transit Suit level and I just don't see myself using for anything other than offroad riding so I can't justify it.
So just as I was leaving I noticed a rack I hadn't really looked at before. It was FirstGear. They had examples of the FirstGear Jaunt and Kenya jackets both in the sub-$300 range. What really surprised me was that both jackets were waterproof with water resistant zippers. It was immediately apparent that FirstGear has really stepped up their game quite a bit. YKK zippers. Metal snaps. And the jackets were both very simple, not over-feature-creep that is apparent in the Olympia gear.
The Jaunt could have been the jacket, but the venting wasn't quite at the level that I'm looking for. The Kenya also would have been the jacket if it was a little longer but it's not really targeted at the off-road world.
Rob had said earlier, for bang/buck FirstGear seems to be leading the pack. Now being able to see all this gear in one place and do comparisons, I would have to agree. I am a little concerned about crash worthiness but interestingly they are now using Transit Suit style TF flexible armor for the elbows and shoulders. I suspect abrasion resistance is in the acceptable range but any kind of off on pavement will destroy it. But at the price, one just goes and buys another, like Rob said.
I had to leave the event early so couldn't try evaluate these jackets in detail, but I did leave wishing that they had a jacket like the Kenya jacket with the same or greater venting but that was longer.
(it's at this point in the story where Rob facepalms.
)
So looking at Revzilla today I noticed that there is a jacket the seems to fit the bill actually ... it's called the Kathmandu.
Rob facepalms.
So I'm going to see if I can't find an example to look at. Initially, what caused me not to consider it was the fact that Rob called in an 80% jacket but comparing it to everything else I realize there's simply not going to be a jacket that's going to work in all conditions.
Rob facepalms.
So I went to an after-hours apparel event over at Bob's BMW last night. I thought it was just going to be new versions of some of the gear they already had but to my surprise it was more like a mini-convention.
It was a catered event done to the same quality level as their for-fee special events.
And it was crowded. There were quite a few people there. What really surprised me was the outside vendors he had.
I noticed a guy, I have forgotten his name but hope that he'll join us here, wearing a Klim Badlands 2 suit. I talked to him for quite some time. Interestingly, despite having purchased it just 6 weeks earlier he was not entirely pleased with his purchase. He pointed out a number of niggling things that were bothering him such a stitching that was coming undone in some seams on the jacket and pants to some velcro panels being slightly crooked. "Just not up to German quality I've gotten used to." he said. (I said nothing.
)Then, to my surprise, he mentioned that Klim had a representative there. It turns out they had the Klim Badlands Pro in my size for me to try on.
It's certainly a solid suit. The fact that they seemed to only provide it in S/M/L sizing was a negative in my opinion. I would liked to have something fit a little closer in a "Long" but that option is not available, at least not off the shelf. Putting it on and wearing the thing for a while, I began to suspect that the features/benefits/fit of the suit do not justify the price. I just couldn't see myself living with the thing for that long. My thought had been that maybe it would end up being something that might replace the Transit Suit as my preferred touring suit, but it's simply not in the same league IMHO.
So I've decided against the Klim.
I also took a close look at Rev-It's new offerings. After how disappointing I've found the Ignition 2 jacket/suit to be I just can't see myself buying another Rev-It suit. IMHO their gear is simply not durable enough.
I also took a very close look at the Olympia Moab and Nomad jackets. Very good venting and they seem to have upped their game a bit but neither jacket seemed like it would handle the punishment of a trip like this very well. I also looked at the X-Moto and it seemed a little too "over-featured" and I think all the silly liner zippers will just end up failing. The camel back was also badly positioned IMHO and might induce a spine injury in an off.
They had a number of BMW Rally 3 suits on sale. I hadn't considered the Rally suit but I have to admit it's very well done. The fit is excellent and the craftsmanship is definite a step up from Klim, again IMHO. There seems to be plenty of venting but not as much as I would really like. Even on sale, the price is in the Transit Suit level and I just don't see myself using for anything other than offroad riding so I can't justify it.
So just as I was leaving I noticed a rack I hadn't really looked at before. It was FirstGear. They had examples of the FirstGear Jaunt and Kenya jackets both in the sub-$300 range. What really surprised me was that both jackets were waterproof with water resistant zippers. It was immediately apparent that FirstGear has really stepped up their game quite a bit. YKK zippers. Metal snaps. And the jackets were both very simple, not over-feature-creep that is apparent in the Olympia gear.
The Jaunt could have been the jacket, but the venting wasn't quite at the level that I'm looking for. The Kenya also would have been the jacket if it was a little longer but it's not really targeted at the off-road world.
Rob had said earlier, for bang/buck FirstGear seems to be leading the pack. Now being able to see all this gear in one place and do comparisons, I would have to agree. I am a little concerned about crash worthiness but interestingly they are now using Transit Suit style TF flexible armor for the elbows and shoulders. I suspect abrasion resistance is in the acceptable range but any kind of off on pavement will destroy it. But at the price, one just goes and buys another, like Rob said.
I had to leave the event early so couldn't try evaluate these jackets in detail, but I did leave wishing that they had a jacket like the Kenya jacket with the same or greater venting but that was longer.
(it's at this point in the story where Rob facepalms.
)So looking at Revzilla today I noticed that there is a jacket the seems to fit the bill actually ... it's called the Kathmandu.
Rob facepalms.
So I'm going to see if I can't find an example to look at. Initially, what caused me not to consider it was the fact that Rob called in an 80% jacket but comparing it to everything else I realize there's simply not going to be a jacket that's going to work in all conditions.
Rob facepalms.
Of course...you could just try on my Kathmandu! I have over a year into my Kathmandu jacket and pants and love them. Quality is terrific, armor is excellent, it really is waterproof, and amazingly tough. Not the cheapest in their range but not the *most* expensive either. And prices have dropped I think. I would by them again in a second. I've tried lots of non-leather gear and the FirstGear stuff has been my favorite. Probably three or four different jackets (including Lisa's and Kevin's) with no issues ever. For leather jackets I still like AlpineStar and Vanson best.
The 80% comment is specifically with regards to when it's really hot. The system has excellent venting but it can't compete with mesh when the temps get really high.
Also...please note that the Kathmandu pant is an overpant, although I usually treat it as a regular pant and just wear riding shorts under it. They have non-overpants as well.
For hot weather and major offroad I'm going with MX pants (Fox, Scott, etc), a MX shirt, and body armor.
It's boots that have me twisted up right now. My main riding boots are my Alpinestars Techtouring Gore-tex, which I love. I'm thinking of getting a pair of the Alpinestar Scout boots for dual-sport. I like the Fox F3R and the O'neil Element boots but they're a bitch for road riding and def not something to walk around in.
The 80% comment is specifically with regards to when it's really hot. The system has excellent venting but it can't compete with mesh when the temps get really high.
Also...please note that the Kathmandu pant is an overpant, although I usually treat it as a regular pant and just wear riding shorts under it. They have non-overpants as well.
For hot weather and major offroad I'm going with MX pants (Fox, Scott, etc), a MX shirt, and body armor.
It's boots that have me twisted up right now. My main riding boots are my Alpinestars Techtouring Gore-tex, which I love. I'm thinking of getting a pair of the Alpinestar Scout boots for dual-sport. I like the Fox F3R and the O'neil Element boots but they're a bitch for road riding and def not something to walk around in.
For the trip across, I'm really hoping not to have to carry a spare set of MX gear. Packing is going to be an interesting issue as it is on these bikes.
For local and primarily offroad trail riding I can certainly see the utility of MX gear.
I've got to go find a pair of the Scout boots to try. I may opt to just wear my combat boots. I'm looking for something that's reasonable to walk in so I can avoid having to pack shoes, and the combat boots are great for that but don't offer much in the way of ankle protection.
For local and primarily offroad trail riding I can certainly see the utility of MX gear.
I've got to go find a pair of the Scout boots to try. I may opt to just wear my combat boots. I'm looking for something that's reasonable to walk in so I can avoid having to pack shoes, and the combat boots are great for that but don't offer much in the way of ankle protection.
"local and primarily offroad trail riding"= exactly
With the boots it isn't about ankle protection, it's about shin protection. One of the most common injuries off-road is having your shin broken by your pegs. Off road and adventure boots have armored shins, real offroad boots have serious shin protection. regular boots such as combat boots, aren't going to cut it in a shin-vrs-peg fight.
With the boots it isn't about ankle protection, it's about shin protection. One of the most common injuries off-road is having your shin broken by your pegs. Off road and adventure boots have armored shins, real offroad boots have serious shin protection. regular boots such as combat boots, aren't going to cut it in a shin-vrs-peg fight.
Also, Anthony's video does a GREAT job of going through the Kathmandu here
As mentioned, over a year into it and it's still awesome.
As mentioned, over a year into it and it's still awesome.
This is why I love this site. There is so much knowledge here. I can't wait to install the new software (he says like a broken record)
I had not considered the shin vs peg angle but you are completely correct. Adventure boots it is.
I'm contemplating a ride up to RevZilla next Saturday. They are open from 10 until 4 ... anyone interested in going?
I had not considered the shin vs peg angle but you are completely correct. Adventure boots it is.
I'm contemplating a ride up to RevZilla next Saturday. They are open from 10 until 4 ... anyone interested in going?
Hard core off road boots are great for protection but suck for walking. Most are hot too. Bring a change for non-riding times, something you can walk in.
I wore regular hiking boots, which worked out but I don't know if I can recommend it. I'm slow.
I wore regular hiking boots, which worked out but I don't know if I can recommend it. I'm slow.
Yea, I guess I'll have to take some shoes after all. I managed without on the big trip, but that's because I used the combat boots.
We're going to go check out some Alpenstar Scouts and maybe few others.
We're going to go check out some Alpenstar Scouts and maybe few others.
I considered the BMW Rallye 3 suit, but the outer shell isn't waterproof. You have to put in the waterproof liner, and then the shell could become waterlogged. I wanted a suit with waterproof (Gore-Tex) outer shell.
The only plus I see to the non-waterproof gear is that it tends to breathe much better. But I think I'll optimize for water proof.
I've seen jackets where the armor was part of a mesh inner liner, with the shell being waterproof. My First Gear Kenya 2 is like that, but no longer available. I don't remember the manufacturer, though, and my google-fu isn't up to the task.